Coronavirus: social, economic and other changes as a result of the pandemic

[oddoneout]

The Government is committed to restoring rights to non-violent protest

. But not any more. From https://assets.publishing.service.go...ent-square.pdf

Sir David Amess

My office looks over Parliament Square. I have long complained about the endless demonstrations that take place on this very busy roundabout. It is absolutely ridiculous. It is very difficult to work because of the noise—the drums, horns and loudspeakers.

There are already procedures in place for controlling the likes of loudspeakers in that area, better to review them if necessary, rather than bring in an out-of-control sledgehammer.
James Murray

The Bill’s attempt to allow the police to restrict protest because of “the noise generated by persons taking part” would make a mockery of our rights. It is shameful that, rather than attack the injustices that people are protesting about, this Government seek to attack the very right to protest itself.

https://www.parallelparliament.co.uk/mp/david-amess/vs/james-murray

Apologies, I can't get the layout of this right for some reason. Hope it isn't too confusing.

[johnb]

Well, given the events in Bristol, perhaps we need those police powers since the protesters are having great difficulty in understanding the word 'peaceful' protest.

There was a very noisy helicopter circling over central Bristol all last night. I looked online to see if I could find out why and was shocked at what I saw. However a number of people from my road attended the protest earlier in the day (it is that type of road) and found it very peaceful.

The pity is that the violence will be used by the government to justify its repressive bill.

[Frances_iom]

The pity is that the violence will be used by the government to justify its repressive bill.

It needs Labour to decide if they are on side of democracy and to vote against the Bill but even then I doubt if sufficient red-wall Tories will also oppose it at the cost of their personal advancement in the Government apparatus - we will sleep walk into an authoritarian rightwing state which is beginning to realise it is broke. Those that voted for 'levelling up' might gain some solace from the levelling down of the majority with a major shift in the imbalance between the wealthy + the rest - crony capitalism at its worst.

[oddoneout]

It needs Labour to decide if they are on side of democracy and to vote against the Bill but even then I doubt if sufficient red-wall Tories will also oppose it at the cost of their personal advancement in the Government apparatus - we will sleep walk into an authoritarian rightwing state which is beginning to realise it is broke. Those that voted for 'levelling up' might gain some solace from the levelling down of the majority with a major shift in the imbalance between the wealthy + the rest - crony capitalism at its worst.

I imagine that not a few Tories will have done what the constituency Con did here - made all the right noises about the Met/Sarah Everard issue - and then voted for the Bill. All the other MP swimmers(or floaters as I term them in particularly dark moments...) in the safe blue sea hereabouts would also have done the same I assume - couldn't be bothered to look it up. I hope that the lone Labour voice did at least follow up words with action, but again I haven't checked; his attachment to the cause can be erratic and he has an eye to career matters so I won't assume what should be obvious.
How convenient for the embryonic dictatorship-leaning government if rent-a-mob continue to sabotage peaceful protests - not that I'm a fan of conspiracy theories of course... And how ironic that all of a sudden supporting the Covid restrictions(limiting gatherings) suddenly becomes a positive in the public and political eye rather than something to be kicked over asap, but possibly for different reasons.

[Serial_Apologist]

It is endemic to the very nature of capitalism that it's political expression should turn to the right and authoritarianism when, inevitably, thrown in crisis by its own inner contradictions, which I and others have outlined many times on this forum. Where the difference seems to be consists in the absence of a coherent left arguing for mass extra-parliamentary protest action, which now seems to have been left to BLM, Extinction Rebellion, and the Women's Movement In the "good old" 70s we were alerted to the possibilities, nay likelihood, of agents provocateurs infiltrating the ranks, and though quite a few got through, some groups adopted clever tactics, signals given to swap places for example, only known to bona fide members of radical groups that would expose them as interlopers - on demos at any rate. There were always those on the extreme left, mostly individuals believing in the revolutionary character of spontaneous action, who would argue, unbelievably, that committing violence would force the authorities to do likewise - maybe such advocates were today's suicide bombers' forbears - thereby forcing "the working class" to "fight back" when faced with dictatorship. Others - one putatively Maoist sect based in Brixton - agitated that the state was already fascist, thereby legitimising physical attacks on the police at any and every available opportunity. "As a result, 90% of their membership are semi-permanently in jail", Tariq Ali said to me, "so sad". It was, to remind old codgers such as myself, the time of mass demonstrations against the Vietnam War, and then against Apartheid, the fascist National Front, and for a United Ireland - a time when the the tabloids, without exception, headlined with "Our Boys in BLue", hailing them as heroes, men (usually) with wives and families, sandwiched between equally obnoxious political sides in the case of anti-fascist marches, when in fact local police chieftains would be seen fraternally coralling the union flag wavers and lining their race hate bellowing to protect them from us lot as they made their intimidatory way through black neighbourhoods showing who really ruled the roost. Subsequent reports, leaks and revelations in the form of confessions, have proved the case we tried to put across to a media-hoodwinked public, and those of us who have lived long enough have been able to turn around and say, "There you are, told you so, but you wouldn't believe us".

The case that the, if I may put it this way, genuinely radical left put forward, was to argue for mass action to physically if necessary block attempts to introduce reactionary legislation, in the parliamentary realm, or cutting or closing down vital services and industries in the name of "rationalisation", on the grounds that "they are few, but we" - meaning organised, mobilised working class people - "are many". The situation of the occupied plant, initially defensive (of jobs, livelihoods), could, and in a few exemplary situations, did provide ideal conditions in which workers across sectors might, in solidarity, create forms of alternative product production and planning based on meeting unmet social needs rather than competitive profitability as decided by unelected boardroom bureaucracy - in other words organs of "dual power" contesting the capitalist status quo, thus prefiguring and esbablishing a new and more sustainable form of society, with technology at the service of shorter working hours and greater social cohesion and self-generated creativity and activity. In all this, a premium was put on collective and self-discipline, for the sake of security and integrity as much as delineating the moral and ethical norms for a better society. Violence of any kind would be seen very much in terms of a last resort; and one does not need any stretching of imagination to see situations around the world today in which this would be the only possible way forward.

[Anastasius]

There was a very noisy helicopter circling over central Bristol all last night. I looked online to see if I could find out why and was shocked at what I saw. However a number of people from my road attended the protest earlier in the day (it is that type of road) and found it very peaceful.

The pity is that the violence will be used by the government to justify its repressive bill.

Then perhaps those who created the violence are to blame ?

[Anastasius]

https://thegreatcritique.wordpress.c...ce-in-bristol/

I was alerted to this response by a Chris Williamson tweet.

Hardy an unbiased viewpoint, Bryn. I've heard of hidden agendas but he didn't even bother to attempt to hide his !

[Dave2002]

Trouble at t' mill

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/23/world/europe/eu-curbs-vaccine-exports.html

[Dave2002]

There was a very noisy helicopter circling over central Bristol all last night. I looked online to see if I could find out why and was shocked at what I saw. However a number of people from my road attended the protest earlier in the day (it is that type of road) and found it very peaceful.

The pity is that the violence will be used by the government to justify its repressive bill.

I don't know much about this. One concern is that if there are plans for peaceful protests - which I think are perfectly legitimate - if there are signs that they may deteriorate into violence some bovver boys may jump on the band wagon because they feel that it would be fun. Some may indeed go along with the express hope of trying to "get involved". OK - they may end up in prison if they are found and caught, but some people are so stupid that they appear not to care.

There are many shades of this. I was surprised that this happened in Bristol - is there a local problem, or was something else going on?

[french frank]

I was surprised that this happened in Bristol - is there a local problem, or was something else going on?

I think there's just a lot of anger about: Black Lives Matter (remember the Edward Colston statue?), anti-lockdown sentiment, the present policing bill (I didn't think Kill the Bill a very 'peaceful' slogan, linked to physical attacks on police and setting police vans on fire while officers were in them).

[Bryn]

I think there's just a lot of anger about: Black Lives Matter (remember the Edward Colston statue?), anti-lockdown sentiment, the present policing bill (I didn't think Kill the Bill a very 'peaceful' slogan, linked to physical attacks on police and setting police vans on fire while officers were in them).

And Bristol has a somewhat longer recentish history of inter-ethnic tensions, too. St Paul's 1981, for instance.

[oddoneout]

I think there's just a lot of anger about: Black Lives Matter (remember the Edward Colston statue?), anti-lockdown sentiment, the present policing bill (I didn't think Kill the Bill a very 'peaceful' slogan, linked to physical attacks on police and setting police vans on fire while officers were in them).

Indeed. At first my befogged brain interpreted the violent images coupled with the slogan as an attack on the police, and took a while to unpick that the bill referred to was the one going through parliament and that the violence was secondary/subsequent to the initial protest. Even now I've sorted that out I still think it is unhelpfully belligerent but, given the strength of feeling I can see how it came about.

[johnb]

There was another protest against the bill yesterday, with police helicopters again circling the centre of Bristol. This time it was relatively peaceful, in comparison with Sunday.

[french frank]

There was another protest against the bill yesterday, with police helicopters again circling the centre of Bristol. This time it was relatively peaceful, in comparison with Sunday.

What's upsetting (to me, at least) is that although one is unequivocally sympathetic to a basic protest, it gets led/taken over by people whose tactics seem obtuse. Anger is a legitimate, often necessary, spur to action: uncontrolled anger is counterproductive.

[vinteuil]

What's upsetting (to me, at least) is that although one is unequivocally sympathetic to a basic protest, it gets led/taken over by people whose tactics seem obtuse. Anger is a legitimate, often necessary, spur to action: uncontrolled anger is counterproductive.

... a girondine rather than a montagnarde, I guess




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