Coronavirus

[teamsaint]

Well there's going to be an interesting situation when all the first jab punters come due for their second within a fairly small time frame at the same time as trying to work through whichever next priority group(which is likely to be larger the further down the age range one goes) has been reached?

There will be more people in the “ reluctant” category as they move down the priority groups.

16-64 with underlying health conditions is a huge group. 7.2 m. I’d prioritise those people and stamp hard on any “ vaccine passport “ nonsense ( which is apart from anything else going to be an admin nightmare) if I was in charge.
Well if Dido can get that kind of job, there’s hope for us all.......

[LHC]

That depends on how you define "shortage". There are obviously constraints on supply but that was always going to be the case.

My appointment was with my local GP practice, who rang me two days prior. It could be that there are different second appointment procedures for those receiving jabs at from GP practices and those who book through the national system and go to the vaccination hubs.

I expect as well that as more production facilities come on line, they are expecting the supply constraints to ease. For Pfizer there is a temporary shortage as they improve production methods at their existing facilities, and they have a new production plant in Marburg, which is due start producing vaccines this month.

By April there should be an improvement in the supply of both the Pfizer and AZ vaccines, and we should also start to take delivery of the Moderna vaccine, which can be used for people having their first jabs.

[Dave2002]

There will be more people in the “ reluctant” category as they move down the priority groups.

Why do you think that? Is it because you think the younger people may be more cautious about the vaccines, and feel that they're likely to be OK anyway and can wait to see how things develop over time, or because they are influenced by social media or other "fake news" sources, or because you think they just don't care?

Although it's true that generally risks are lower for younger people, even 30-50 year old people can become ill, and sometimes some of them die, though the typical risk might be quite low and other accidents might be just as likely. Sadly I'm no longer young, so I can't apply that mind set to my own circumstances.

For younger people, it does seem that being vaccinated might now be considered as more to help others, rather than to significantly reduce one's own personal risk. This was not known a year ago - so I thank all the young people who are willing to be vaccinated to keep the disease at bay.

[Bryn]

There will be more people in the “ reluctant” category as they move down the priority groups.

16-64 with underlying health conditions is a huge group. 7.2 m. I’d prioritise those people and stamp hard on any “ vaccine passport “ nonsense ( which is apart from anything else going to be an admin nightmare) if I was in charge.
Well if Dido can get that kind of job, there’s hope for us all.......

Her (metaphorical) pyre awaits.

[DracoM]

Not just a nightmare, but almost certainly it will suffer infiltration from forgers who will forge / sell illicit docs.

What I canNOT understand is how some care home assistants / helpers are REFUSING to be vaccinated? Such helpers are at the VERY frontline, thus at most risk to themselves, their families and friends and anyone else they come into contact with.

Utterly gobsmacking. I mean, don't they KNOW the stats? How can they NOT know them?

[teamsaint]

Why do you think that? Is it because you think the younger people may be more cautious about the vaccines, and feel that they're likely to be OK anyway and can wait to see how things develop over time, or because they are influenced by social media or other "fake news" sources, or because you think they just don't care?

Although it's true that generally risks are lower for younger people, even 30-50 year old people can become ill, and sometimes some of them die, though the typical risk might be quite low and other accidents might be just as likely. Sadly I'm no longer young, so I can't apply that mind set to my own circumstances.

For younger people, it does seem that being vaccinated might now be considered as more to help others, rather than to significantly reduce one's own personal risk. This was not known a year ago - so I thank all the young people who are willing to be vaccinated to keep the disease at bay.

It is just becuase that is what the surveys have indicated.

[Frances_iom]

Not just a nightmare, but almost certainly it will suffer infiltration from forgers who will forge / sell illicit docs.

What I canNOT understand is how some care home assistants / helpers are REFUSING to be vaccinated? Such helpers are at the VERY frontline, thus at most risk to themselves, their families and friends and anyone else they come into contact with.

Utterly gobsmacking. I mean, don't they KNOW the stats? How can they NOT know them?

it's the elephant in the room that commentators are wary to comment on - BAME - low paid staff + in some cases fearful of the false reports emanating (IMO originally from Russia in an attempt to cause problems) and amplified by the Trump idiots in the states.
ETA on the only day early December I risked a visit to National archives - this involved changing trains at Clapham junction (which is actually in Brixton) - 99.5% of people both on board trains + on platform wore masks - the all too obvious exceptions were youngish black males.

[vinteuil]

Her (metaphorical) pyre awaits.

... one can hope. Sadly, such somehow often seem to find a way to breeze thro' life and not suffer any adverse event.

There was an obit in The Times today for Lord Vestey. What a family! Enuff to make commies of us all...


.

[oddoneout]

Not just a nightmare, but almost certainly it will suffer infiltration from forgers who will forge / sell illicit docs.

What I canNOT understand is how some care home assistants / helpers are REFUSING to be vaccinated? Such helpers are at the VERY frontline, thus at most risk to themselves, their families and friends and anyone else they come into contact with.

Utterly gobsmacking. I mean, don't they KNOW the stats? How can they NOT know them?

It is quite possible that some workers don't know the facts or fully understand - don't follow the news, English not their first language - but even if they do they may nor take it on board - information not coming from a source that has credibility for them, distrust of anything 'official'( not limited to the BAME community, and not entirely unjustified thanks to the likes of Priti Patel ) , nobody around them in favour, possibly actively against.
However should this not be the employers' responsibility - to inform and support? But how many of them do that in normal times for things like workers rights etc, so that would be the exception I suspect.

[cloughie]

... one can hope. Sadly, such somehow often seem to find a way to breeze thro' life and not suffer any adverse event.

There was an obit in The Times today for Lord Vestey. What a family! Enuff to make commies of us all...


.

I remember their tax avoidance and not using Dewhurst thereafter (that was 1980).

[DracoM]

It is quite possible that some workers don't know the facts or fully understand - don't follow the news, English not their first language - but even if they do they may nor take it on board - information not coming from a source that has credibility for them, distrust of anything 'official'( not limited to the BAME community, and not entirely unjustified thanks to the likes of Priti Patel ) , nobody around them in favour, possibly actively against.
However should this not be the employers' responsibility - to inform and support? But how many of them do that in normal times for things like workers rights etc, so that would be the exception I suspect.

That is SO, so scary.

[oddoneout]

That is SO, so scary.

This explains some of the difficulties https://www.gponline.com/gps-raise-a...rticle/1704790
I haven't listened to this podcast but the summary suggests it covers the historical and background issues https://www.theguardian.com/news/aud...nities-podcast
What is frustrating is that this is not a new problem. Such communities have always been less than keen on vaccine and other health interventions. Cultural reasons often play a big part, such as who a woman is permitted to speak to, and without understanding such constraints any message, however important, is going to fall on deaf ears, even more so where there are language/literacy barriers. Getting across the basic space/face message has proved a challenge, so how much more for something which involves a physical 'assault'.

[Dave2002]

This explains some of the difficulties https://www.gponline.com/gps-raise-a...rticle/1704790
I haven't listened to this podcast but the summary suggests it covers the historical and background issues https://www.theguardian.com/news/aud...nities-podcast
What is frustrating is that this is not a new problem. Such communities have always been less than keen on vaccine and other health interventions. Cultural reasons often play a big part, such as who a woman is permitted to speak to, and without understanding such constraints any message, however important, is going to fall on deaf ears, even more so where there are language/literacy barriers. Getting across the basic space/face message has proved a challenge, so how much more for something which involves a physical 'assault'.

I recently saw a video clip about vaccines and jabs in an African country. The community were offered free injections (not quite sure what it was for, but it was for a real threat to the community), and nobody wanted to know, until one African lady explained to the rest that it would help them and the community, and then asked for hersel to be vaccinated in front of the others. IIRC she also explained that just because the injection was "white man" stuff, that didn't mean that it was going to harm them. Then almost everyone followed suit.

If people don't understand, or are afraid of the injection, then it is likely that many will refuse.

[Bryn]

Well, wadyano?

https://bylinetimes.com/2021/02/05/crony-ratio-conservative-donations-government-coronavirus-contracts/?fbclid=IwAR22cdxxxWZ0US4__DMoatcRXv5qMwZdDa-7u1Bf48gjdPLC5gD5qhXe1a0

[teamsaint]

I recently saw a video clip about vaccines and jabs in an African country. The community were offered free injections (not quite sure what it was for, but it was for a real threat to the community), and nobody wanted to know, until one African lady explained to the rest that it would help them and the community, and then asked for hersel to be vaccinated in front of the others. IIRC she also explained that just because the injection was "white man" stuff, that didn't mean that it was going to harm them. Then almost everyone followed suit.

If people don't understand, or are afraid of the injection, then it is likely that many will refuse.

The links that I think I posted a while ago about issues with non specific effects of non live vaccines took their data from a vaccination programme in West Africa. There seems little doubt that there were very substantial issues with the way that particular vaccines , and the way they are administered , affect overall health.
Now I don’t know much beyond reading around that particular issue, but problems such as those identified could have far reaching effects on how interventions are perceived. And just ignoring the issues in the messaging, IMO probably doesn’t actually help put over positive messages, as this article suggests.

https://eyeonglobalhealth.com/2019/03/13/non-specific-effects-of-vaccines-and-their-neglect/