Have Western Politics Shifted eo the Right in the 2010s?

[Conchis]

I didn't agree with the former Lord Stansgate on many things, but when he observed that 'poverty shifts people to the right', he was absolutely correct.

The 2007/08 financial crisis which most of Britain has never recovered from, more or less guaranteed the election of a government that would be pledged to enact austerity measures. Labour seemed happy to lose the election of 2010, knowing that it would have torn itself apart if, as a government, it had had to go about slashing all the initiatives of the Blair years. But it failed to come up with a radically different strategy in opposition, meaning that a 'proper' Conservative government was elected in 2015. This government was not only ideologically committed to austerity as a means of rolling back the state but its leader also had to offer a Referendum on E.U. membership in order to placate his ravenous right-wing. It was discontent with austerity that fuelled the Leave vote in 2016 and a Conservative party that is now controlled by its noisy minority of Brexiteers will use the state of crisis caused by Brexit to turn Britain into a version of authoritarian Singapore (but with wet weather).

That's quite a lot of mileage for one financial crash.

In America, despair at politics has led to the election of a non-politician to the nation's highest office. His opponents don't know how to deal with him, and the 2020 election is (so far) his to lose.

Brazil, a country that has never taken naturally to democracy, has gone a step further and elected a bona-fide authoritarian fascists to its presidency. This 'Trump of the Tropics' actually wants to force the clock back on social issues, criminalising homosexuality etc; as Brazil is a naturally reactionary country, he stands a good chance of success, this being a battle that most western conservatives have long since given up on.


This is the way I see things, but you may see them differently. I'd be interested to know if other forum members feel their own politics have shifted in reaction to the last ten years of world events? Mine certainly have.....

[ardcarp]

It seems that only in some European countries where coalition governments are the norm can moderate (and in my opinion sensible) politic flourish. This does not eliminate the danger of the formation of vociferous small groups, mainly from the extreme right; in fact it could make it worse. It is a source of great sadness to me that the middle ground of UK politics is only occupied by the moderate wing of the Tory Party and ditto the Labour Perty. I find it quite inexplicable that in these fractious times a Liberal Democratic party has no appeal to the electorate. My own political direction (you did ask, Conchie!) has shifted leftwards over the years. My parents were of a Liberal persausion, but my earliest votes were (incredible though it seems) cast to the Conservatives. I've been a Labour voter for years, though I am by no means happy with the present state of the Labour Party. At the last and catastrophic election I was approached by a Conservative who had quit her party in disgust and was now campaigning like a whirlwind for the Lib Dems, entirely because of the Europe issue. She convinced me to do a leaflet drop of my entire village for them...which I did. I even displayed a large lozenge-shaped board outside my house, to the amusemnt of my near neighbours. It is perhaps a testament to the good nature of most of our citizens that during my blitzing of the village (which is True Blue to the core) I got no aggro from those whose hallowed lawns and drives I traversed...merely expressions of bewilderment, pity...and a few sincere attempts to convert me from the errors of my ways.

[Conchis]

It seems that only in some European countries where coalition governments are the norm can moderate (and in my opinion sensible) politic flourish. This does not eliminate the danger of the formation of vociferous small groups, mainly from the extreme right; in fact it could make it worse. It is a source of great sadness to me that the middle ground of UK politics is only occupied by the moderate wing of the Tory Party and ditto the Labour Perty. I find it quite inexplicable that in these fractious times a Liberal Democratic party has no appeal to the electorate. My own political direction (you did ask, Conchie!) has shifted leftwards over the years. My parents were of a Liberal persausion, but my earliest votes were (incredible though it seems) cast to the Conservatives. I've been a Labour voter for years, though I am by no means happy with the present state of the Labour Party.

Yes, I think FTTP has become a bad joke. The time for it was probably 1997, but Blair's huge majority put paid to that idea.

So-called 'Lord' Owen was interviewed in the Guardian the other day. The man's ego has obviously not been diminished by the years but his political antenna is a hopeless as it always was. A loss to politics? I don't think so....

[Serial_Apologist]

In answer I would say yes, in a global political sense too, but that the rightward shift goes back a lot further than the banking crash, encompassing culture and the social mindset as much as limited parliamentary and electoral politics. Deeply imprinted after the advent of Consumerism, the "western" mind was already prone to individualism (as distinct from "selfishness" in a moral sense) by the model handed down over centures by fundamental Judaeo-Christian ideas that separated Mankind from an effectively manufactured natural realm it saw (and still often sees) as sharing too many of nature's baser instincts unredeemed by an Almighty's grace to be capable of that illusory aim perfection in this world, so that solidarity is made merely provisional, the anomaly rather than the norm, reserved for emergency situations only, otherwise we're all on our own, chum. Pre-western colonial societies not subscribing to the above, more often than not identified and rooted in the natural world, albeit supernaturally mediated, were forced into having to accept what came with bible and bullet as self-evidently superior and then as models, warping what otherwise might in geographically propitious equivalent circumstances to those of the temperate North and West have evolved equivalently, but probably, unintervened, more gradually and eco-friendlily. Mind/body dualism and resulting body dysphoria are far more generally prevalent in the West than might be supposed when speaking of anorexia or obesity, whose growing ubiquitousness are useful additional aids towards doing ourselves down. Western dominance and domination, of non-western peoples and ecosystems, has brought us to a situation where the western auto-protective mindset now clicks in defensively saying, don't blame us, blame human nature, adduce otherness categorisations already encrypted in the ways in which the linguistic and conceptual engage with cultural artifice, itself the product and reinforcer of status quo reductionist thinking and behaviour. (Viz "dumbing down"). Then come the abreactions: chronic obedience, habit forming, scapegoating, greed, objectification, obsession, extremes of escapism, nostalgia for mythical pasts, sexual titillation, etc etc., and then the projecting and self-blaming, all reinforced by media sources invested with authority and power. One can go into specifics on all this, but that just about sums it all up as to where we now are.

[teamsaint]

Yes, I think FTTP has become a bad joke. The time for it was probably 1997, but Blair's huge majority put paid to that idea.

So-called 'Lord' Owen was interviewed in the Guardian the other day. The man's ego has obviously not been diminished by the years but his political antenna is a hopeless as it always was. A loss to politics? I don't think so....

I happened to meet the noble lord very briefly, not long ago. His political antenna( and I hasten to add that i was engaged in small talk about his car tyre puncture, and politics was raised by somebody else) was saying that we may end up using EFTA as a holding position for a few years, which is probably as good a guess as anybody else has made.

He may have a big ego, but he hid it well at our event.

[Conchis]

I happened to meet the noble lord very briefly, not long ago. His political antenna( and I hasten to add that i was engaged in small talk about his car tyre puncture, and politics was raised by somebody else) was saying that we may end up using EFTA as a holding position for a few years, which is probably as good a guess as anybody else has made.

He may have a big ego, but he hid it well at our event.

In the same interview, he outs himself as a disaster capitalist, so it should come as no surprise that he supports Brexit.

[ardcarp]

I met 'the noble lord' too quite recently. I was singing in a concert when a member of the audience slumped in her chair in a dead faint. (I hope it was not as a result of our vocal efforts.) David Owen happened to be present, and swiftly acted 'doctor in the house'. He seemed a very charming man and..in this role at least...efficient and unassuming.

I disagree with him utterly about Europe, but if we must leave, then EFTA would probably work quite well. Norway, which has to protect its own rather fragile agricultural community with tariffs, seems to function on this basis.

[Richard Barrett]

In answer I would say yes, in a global political sense too, but that the rightward shift goes back a lot further than the banking crash

It goes back to the 1980s surely, when Thatcher (and Reagan in the US) found a way to turn back the gradual shift towards social democracy which had characterised the previous few decades. And of course the succeeding generation of supposedly social-democratic leaders (Blair, Schröder etc.) continued along the same lines. Out of these circumstances flowed the Iraq war, the banking crash and now the rise of a populist right with, in many cases, more than a tinge (if I may use that word) of fascism. I think it's up to us on the side of politics that cares about things like equality and the environment to hold our nerve, keep the vision in our sights, and counter that tendency wherever and however possible. Have I previously quoted these words from David Graeber's essay "Revolutions in Reverse"? I think it has some relevance in this connection.

"Right and Left political perspectives are founded, above all, on different assumptions about the ultimate realities of power. The Right is rooted in a political ontology of violence, where being realistic means taking into account the forces of destruction. In reply the Left has consistently proposed variations on a political ontology of the imagination, in which the forces that are seen as the ultimate realities that need to be taken into account are those (forces of production, creativity…) that bring things into being."

[LMcD]

I agree with much of #1. In Europe, events in Poland and Hungary and the recent election results in The Netherlands are a worrying sign of the way things are going. Insecurity and fear, arguably unjustified in most cases, feed the local equivalent of 'Little Englandism' that is not addressed by established parties.
My own political views have changed only inasmuch as in May's local elections I shall diligently endeavour to find out which candidates are most likely to come bottom and vote for them as long as they're harmless rather than nasty. At national level, I've never voted Conservative in my life and am hardly likely to start now!

[Andrew]

Realising this comment is added almost a year after the last one and after both a General Election and after our departure from the European Union, it might be an apposite time to re-visit it.

I agree that politics has moved to the right in the last few years, although I don't see this as a problem per se. One needs to address the reasoning behind this move, rather than the move itself, and I consider some of this move is a direct response to the dilution of some countries' cultural identities. Many of the Accession states (the newest member of the European Union) spent 40+ years under the influence of the Soviet Union and, after the collapse of same, felt what we would call political freedom for the first time. Having won this freedom, these countries' leaders took them (with the electorates' permission) into the European Union, thus surrendering this hard-fought for freedom after too short a time. Many citizens of these countries don't think of themselves as "Europeans" but as Hungarians, Poles, Czechs etc. and feel an affinity for these links. I believe the European Union denigrates these opinions and feelings at its peril....

[eighthobstruction]

Realising this comment is added almost a year after the last one and after both a General Election and after our departure from the European Union, it might be an apposite time to re-visit it.

I agree that politics has moved to the right in the last few years, although I don't see this as a problem per se. One needs to address the reasoning behind this move, rather than the move itself, and I consider some of this move is a direct response to the dilution of some countries' cultural identities. Many of the Accession states (the newest member of the European Union) spent 40+ years under the influence of the Soviet Union and, after the collapse of same, felt what we would call political freedom for the first time. Having won this freedom, these countries' leaders took them (with the electorates' permission) into the European Union, thus surrendering this hard-fought for freedom after too short a time. Many citizens of these countries don't think of themselves as "Europeans" but as Hungarians, Poles, Czechs etc. and feel an affinity for these links. I believe the European Union denigrates these opinions and feelings at its peril....

....Ah interesting Andrew....and there was me thinking you were a newly joined mole from MI5 looking in on us....give me ponder time....Strange that you have chosen this one when you could have chosen one about Chocolate Biscuits, Whisky, Sunsets, what you are cooking or even music....I'm pondering pondering....

[Andrew]

Sorry, Eightobstruction, but the reasoning's more prosaic! I've recently bought a book by Kate Whitehead, entitled "The third Programme", which covers the development of the Third Programme, from its inception until its demise in 1970. It only covers the spoken work of the station; ideas, talks, discussions, poetry etc., which is, I suppose, where my greater interest lies. The dichotomy between the audience size, "educating" the audience, minority views, "highbrow" broadcasting etc. are all covered in the book, and are of interest to me-hence my graduation from the general forum to this arena....

Sorry to disillusion you!

[eighthobstruction]

Sorry, Eightobstruction, but the reasoning's more prosaic! I've recently bought a book by Kate Whitehead, entitled "The third Programme", which covers the development of the Third Programme, from its inception until its demise in 1970. It only covers the spoken work of the station; ideas, talks, discussions, poetry etc., which is, I suppose, where my greater interest lies. The dichotomy between the audience size, "educating" the audience, minority views, "highbrow" broadcasting etc. are all covered in the book, and are of interest to me-hence my graduation from the general forum to this arena....

Sorry to disillusion you!

Yeah, but, what sort of choc biscuits do you like....??

[Andrew]

Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, repeat ad nausiam

[eighthobstruction]

Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, Jaffa cakes, repeat ad nausiam

....I think in 1970, I was probably reading On the Road for the first time, The Third Programme was a strange place that I didn't understand. The Radio Times and Listener were important, as important as Spectator , Statesman, and possibly Punch [if dentists waiting rooms are to be believed.]....