Is recycling worthwhile?

[Serial_Apologist]

True, it probably does depend where you live. I made straight for Google and searched for Bristol licensed waste disposal. Several possibilities (failing the local council) but an address, telephone number, website, description of the company might suggest which one seemed best, most traceable if something went wrong. That seems easier than disposing of Lat's (or mine) tin of paint. I do think I would have challenged (20/20 hindsight - or rather not being there at all) someone dumping stuff against my front wall saying 'The council is coming'. Where has the council been told to come? To my address? Why?

I was indeed taken in, and kicked myself afterwards for not thinking to note down their vehicle number. But it's not always easy correctly assessing sudden unexpected situations.

Our gardener, who has a largish white van, agreed to transport some recyclables of mine to the local recycling centre. On arrival the man guarding the entrance refused us, saying nothing delivered by van was acceptable. The gardener surmised this as being because firms commonly abused the facility. But this was despite there being no signs indicating his vehicle as belonging to any company. So we literally drove around the corner, parked up, and carried the stuff - which was now accepted! How daft was that???

[french frank]

merely has dispersal vents for its methane.

As harmless as your average cow?

[Bryn]

As harmless as your average cow?

Indeed, though I think the rationale was that, due to the age and design of the site, the methane output would not be economical to collect and use.

[teamsaint]

Somebody has dumped a washing machine in a lay by near here. Last night.
It costs £12 to have it collected, or you can drive it to the tip. And where this was dumped, you would have to have a car to het it there.

There are lots of issues around recyclying, not least government’s hypocrisy in being complicit with a disastrously throwaway society, ( cheap washing machines that are cheaper to replace than repair) but we do also bear a responsibility for our own actions.

[french frank]

but we do also bear a responsibility for our own actions.

In the end, that may be the best we can do.

Depends where you live (again) but when I had a new cooker fitted I was told to just leave the old one outside my front wall. I did so with misgivings, but decided to get it collected anyway. By the time the men turned up to remove it, it had gone. The metal collectors tour the streets looking for such treasures.

[Serial_Apologist]

Somebody has dumped a washing machine in a lay by near here. Last night.
It costs £12 to have it collected, or you can drive it to the tip. And where this was dumped, you would have to have a car to het it there.

There are lots of issues around recyclying, not least government’s hypocrisy in being complicit with a disastrously throwaway society, ( cheap washing machines that are cheaper to replace than repair) but we do also bear a responsibility for our own actions.

Yes but what choice do we have, in the ultimate sense? I instanced recently purchased fans that proved unrepairable I had found thrown away in the non-recyclables. The way the system is set up to "work", if we don't buy the throwaway stuff we're told will be unrepairable before long due to no longer available components, we're doing others out of employment!

[french frank]

Yes but what choice do we have, in the ultimate sense? I instanced recently purchased fans that proved unrepairable I had found thrown away in the non-recyclables. The way the system is set up to "work", if we don't buy the throwaway stuff we're told will be unrepairable before long due to no longer available components, we're doing others out of employment!

The Repair Café movement is around in many places.

And all sorts of small local repair shops.

[teamsaint]

Yes but what choice do we have, in the ultimate sense? I instanced recently purchased fans that proved unrepairable I had found thrown away in the non-recyclables. The way the system is set up to "work", if we don't buy the throwaway stuff we're told will be unrepairable before long due to no longer available components, we're doing others out of employment!

Sorry if I wasn’t clear, I meant that we have a responsibility to clear up our own mess if that is an option open to us. In this case, it clearly was.
I agree with you about the unrepairable stuff.

[Dave2002]

Sorry if I wasn’t clear, I meant that we have a responsibility to clear up our own mess if that is an option open to us. In this case, it clearly was.
I agree with you about the unrepairable stuff.

Some things really are difficult. A piano tuner has recently "condemned" a couple of pianos which we own. Actually I suspect we'll really keep on using them - we're not expecting perfection, or anything like that. However he did suggest that effectively they are worthless, so how would we get rid of them as and when we decide to do so? One option would be to buy one or more substantially better pianos from a dealer, and try to do a deal so that the old one(s) got taken away.

Many of us - and indeed many industries - try to forget/ignore the costs of decommissioning or disposal - but it's wrong to assume that's a zero cost process. The issue then is who is going to actually take on the responsibility. In the case of items which can be passed on it's the last user who will have to figure out how to do the disposal, and presumably take on the costs involved as well.

[oddoneout]

so how would we get rid of them as and when we decide to do so?

Deconstruct and dispose of components? The wooden elements are well seasoned and in some cases may be of kinds not so easy for wood workers to source these days, scrap metal usually has enough value for disposal not to cost, and small parts such as strings then become easier to dispose of as household waste.
I note that our county's waste disposal facilities have changed their policy with regard to vans and trailers now that charging has been brought in for DIY and similar waste, so in theory if I was facing this problem I could load it onto a trailer or van and expect the operatives to accept it as household waste. Getting it into the appropriate skip might be a tad difficult.....

[Dave2002]

Getting it into the appropriate skip might be a tad difficult.....

Re methane and CO2, I'd like to recommend the book "How bad are bananas" by Mike Berners-Lee. I think it's a very good book, though it could do with a bit of an update since it dates from 2010, but it does help to put some aspects of recycling and reuse into perspective. Pages 61-62 are specifically about waste.

[oddoneout]

Re methane and CO2, I'd like to recommend the book "How bad are bananas" by Mike Berners-Lee. I think it's a very good book, though it could do with a bit of an update since it dates from 2010, but it does help to put some aspects of recycling and reuse into perspective. Pages 61-62 are specifically about waste.

I'll look out for that one thanks.
Once the facts are available about certain things sometimes uncomfortable conclusions arise, and as with so many other aspects of life it isn't a straightforward decision as to the best way forward. Sometimes one has to settle for 'least bad'. The car scrappage scheme highlighted many of the pitfalls of a simplistic approach, especially when business interests are part of the process.
Something that I find really annoying is greenwashing, which seems to combine the twin evils of poor evidence (often through scientific ignorance) and commercial pressure. The advertising for so-called green energy tariffs are a particular bugbear, relying as they do on the public's ignorance of the way electricity is supplied to the home. The increased emphasis on recycling as the solution to waste brings out equally non-critical unsubstantiated soundbites, conveniently omitting the processes(and their environmental costs) involved in making waste into something usable.

[Serial_Apologist]

Some things really are difficult. A piano tuner has recently "condemned" a couple of pianos which we own. Actually I suspect we'll really keep on using them - we're not expecting perfection, or anything like that. However he did suggest that effectively they are worthless, so how would we get rid of them as and when we decide to do so? One option would be to buy one or more substantially better pianos from a dealer, and try to do a deal so that the old one(s) got taken away.

Many of us - and indeed many industries - try to forget/ignore the costs of decommissioning or disposal - but it's wrong to assume that's a zero cost process. The issue then is who is going to actually take on the responsibility. In the case of items which can be passed on it's the last user who will have to figure out how to do the disposal, and presumably take on the costs involved as well.

The American experimental composer Annea Lockwood's solution was to create a work of music out of getting rid of unwanted pianos!

I'm not sure if the sound track is calibrated to the visuals!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pS5lHF-KesM

[french frank]

so how would we get rid of them as and when we decide to do so?

1. Freecycle which was set up specifically to keep stuff out of landfill.

2. Reduce it to small pieces and see if any of the pieces were recyclable, as oddoneout said. I made a nice little wooden box to fit my shoulder plane into out of the framework from someone's dismantled conservatory. I have lots of small pieces of good timber which 'might come in useful', but if not, someone on freecycle would take it.

On the whole, I think Bristol is probably quite good at managing its waste - theoretically - they don't always collect when they say they will, though . And street cleaning could be a lot better after the lorries have been … .

[Dave2002]

1. Freecycle which was set up specifically to keep stuff out of landfill.

Freecycle doen't always work well. We have on occasion failed to give items away on Freecycle, but then had a queue of people wanting to pay modest (but useful) amounts for the same items on Gumtree

.

2. Reduce it to small pieces and see if any of the pieces were recyclable ...

I really don't fancy attempting this with a piano .....